Well I hardly know where to start, with everything that's been happening in this house since I first joined on here, and have been talking with all of you, my fellow foxhole buddies...it's a little crazy, the stuff i'm starting to see.
My husband came home this week. He'd been away for a month on a job; I did nothing but soul-search while he was away. And I'm starting to take a good hard look at things.
Someone else on here commented on how people join here writing about a certain subject, and then before you know it, the layers peel away and you see what the issues TRULY are. You ain't lyin'!
I've been so frozen in a state of confusion, not trusting my own feelings, that lately all I've been clinging to is my prayer which says, PLEASE REVEAL WHATEVER NEEDS TO BE REVEALED, AND HEAL WHATEVER NEEDS TO BE HEALED.
Well. All sorts of things are coming to the surface. In retrospect I would change the title of my original post, about 'bad in bed/no chemistry' with my husband- because I think we have much bigger problems than that. That's only a symptom. I was so baffled and lost when I first came on here that all I could think to do was start with the basest, most primal ache I was having, being sad about our sex life. But shovels-full of dirt have been lifted away since he came home and I have to rethink what might actually be going on with us.
So, I have never enjoyed sex with my husband; from the wedding night on, something was just OFF. But I loved and admired and respected him so I ignored it and/or hoped for the best. But it's only become increasingly awkward over the years, for me anyway (his level of interest, which on the Enthusiasm Scale I'd rank about 1-2) has stayed the same. And i've swung back and forth between wishing like crazy he was into me more as a person, so that he'd be into me more sexually, and not even caring any more, because the sex is so agonizingly unfulfilling.
The fight last month before he left was the one that finally started to break my heart. It's the one I wrote about before, when I first joined on here- the one where I was just in total despair over feeling no sexual connection with him, that he never initiates anything with me and when it does happen, every month or two, he is really unenthusiastic about it and it lasts two minutes. I just don't feel close to him at all sexually, and completely unfulfilled physically, and beyond lonely emotionally. I was getting to that crossroads again, where I'm struggling to see our future, and I worked up all my nerve and went to him. I told him I missed him, that I needed him, that I ached for him, and we need to talk about it, that I feel like I'm dying inside.
For the first three minutes he was ok, calmly responding that the truth of the matter was that for him, although he finds me physically attractive and even sexy, he is "not spiritually attracted to me" and that if I was closer to God, we'd have the bond I was looking for.
I was crushed, of course, but in a weird way at least glad he was giving me a reason. (A reason I thought was completely preposterous since I'm a devoted Christian too, but at least it gave us something we could talk about.) I did start to cry, because hearing this is upsetting and confusing- and asked him to tell me what he meant, and to pinpoint what I could be doing differently. It went downhill fast from there. The shouting got louder and louder, and my crying got louder and louder, and everything I said to try to explain or defend myself just enraged him. Some of what he screamed at me:
(when i said i missed him and needed him: ) "WELL YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO NEED ME, YOU'RE ONLY SUPPOSED TO NEED GOD!!"
(when I said, i'm so lonely i dont know what to do: ) "ANYTHING YOU LACK IN THIS MARRIAGE IS BECAUSE OF YOU!!"
(when I said, you're my husband, you're the only one I can come to about this: ) "WHEN ARE YOU JUST GOING TO OWN IT, THAT YOU HAVE ISSUES WHEN IT COMES TO MEN, AND THIS IS YOUR PROBLEM, NOT MINE!"
(when I sobbed that I don't know what he means, and I don't know what to do: ) "YOU NEED TO GET YOURSELF RIGHT WITH GOD IF WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A FUTURE. I'VE DONE THE WORK, I'VE DONE IT ALONE (seeking God, he means- ) AND NOW IT'S YOUR TURN. THIS IS ON YOU. YOU DECIDE"
and repeatedly, at different points: "DON'T YOU PUT YOUR ISSUES ON ME. THIS IS BETWEEN YOU AND GOD".
(when I beg him to stop yelling, and I even tell him I'll receive his words better if he's not yelling: ) "YOU ARE THE ONLY ONE WHO PUSHES ME TO THIS POINT! THIS IS BECAUSE OF YOU! YOU ARE SO PRIDEFUL AND WILLFUL AND SELF-CENTERED THAT THIS IS THE ONLY WAY I CAN GET THROUGH TO YOU!!"
My reactions through all this run the gamut; I cry of course, sometimes quietly, sometimes a full-on wail, which seems to fan the flame but I can't help it; I always try to calm him down, saying Please can we just talk like normal people, please don't yell: i beg him every time, and tell him I cant take it when he yells at me like that; other moments I get angry back and try to defend myself, I yell too just so he can hear what I'm saying...
But by far the worst part(!) and he has always done this, and I absolutely cannot take it any more- I start a sentence and I get about three words in and he SCREAMS OVER TOP OF ME finishing the sentence for me with what he THINKS I was going to say- and he's not even close half the time!- and I shout PLEASE LET ME TALK! YOU HAVE TO LET ME TALK! and he just goes ballistic, screaming, "I ALREADY KNOW WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO SAY AND IT'S BULL****/A LIE/I DON'T EVEN NEED TO HEAR IT!" (Take your pick, he alternates between the three - every argument, for years.) He will not stop doing this no matter how many times I beg him and say, 'I deserve to be heard too, please let me have a voice'. makes no difference.
I am clearly an idiot, or just very determined to save us- I tried again a few nights ago to talk about this again, again very gently and non-confrontational, but you can imagine right where it went, Except this time I came right out and told him the stakes were very high- that i dont know if i can do this any more- and all that did was make him more immovable than ever that everything is on me, and that if he has to lose me he will, if that's what it takes to save me. whaaaaaat
No sleep that night. my eyes were so swollen from crying I looked like I'd gone two rounds with Mike Tyson and yet the tears kept coming. THIS ISNT RIGHT, THIS ISN'T NORMAL, I kept telling myself. So the sad desperate online search began, I was so desperate for answers or advice. It yielded some revelations, by the time it was all over, like this-
"most women don't take to a (verbal) abuser, sexually, once he shows his controlling side. Most who are abused are too traumatized to regain the level of trust necessary for physical intimacy."
OMG. Is this what's been happening???
I'm thinking back to everything he has said to me over the years. Sometimes in exact words, a lot of the time through repeated themes…That I'm not spiritual enough, that I'm 'not capable of making good decisions', that he 'knows me better than I know myself', and her;s what I am/what I'm not...that I need to believe everything he says because he's here to protect me, and that he only speaks the truth. I've been told during many arguments, in response to standing my ground, times that I am immature, insecure, and unstable.
I'm so confused. How does this line up with the other half of him? He's not one of those cruel control-freak monsters who screams if dinner is burned or if his socks aren't arranged like he likes them. He takes things in stride half the time, someone can cut him off in traffic and he barely bats an eye. He thanks me for taking good care of him, He tells me how much he loves me and is thankful for me and would be lost without me. But there's something about him having to maintain control of he and I that seems to be a major trigger for him. We get along ok if everything in our relationship is going his way, I'm noticing. He's really sweet and gentle and writes me beautiful love letters and buys me everything I could want, and is genuinely tender with me. Takes me for surprise romantic picnics. Remembers what all my favorite things are and brings them home to me whenever he can. THIS IS THE REAL HIM. He can totally melt my heart and not by being a snake charmer; Those other jerks are actually rotten to the core and the sweet side is the fake side- but my husband is a genuinely loving man, the part of him that isn't damaged. But… well… even in our day to day stuff, I have to admit… he makes me feel bad ALL the time, and I've questioned for years if that's what it's supposed to feel like. He snaps at me over stuff and tells me if I'm hurt, it's because I'm too sensitive. I've trusted him so much and for so long it never occurred to me that he could be wrong when he makes everything my fault, and that I end up apologizing constantly, over things he's just hurt my feelings over. Something sticky spills in the fridge that i didnt even know about, it's immediately, "What did you do??!" and he's so aggravated. At my office Christmas party last year, when I was so excited to have everyone meet him for the first time, he was so pissed because I was mistaken, I told him it was a dressy night (and half the staff showed up casual, we were dressy) that he acted like a complete ass the entire night, being stand-offish to all my friends, and to my doctor boss, and I was so mortified, and kept trying to be extra-cheery and laugh it off in front of everyone, but he insisted we leave early, and yelled at me the whole way home. And I ended up crying and apologizing like crazy .
I understand where it comes from, i really do, and it's awful. he was severely beaten by his father as a little boy and even worse, verbally tormented to a degree few of us can understand. He says he's made peace over it and forgiven his father, and he talks bout it with no bitterness so I've believed him, I've chosen to believe him.
But knowing this doesn't make it any easier when it's turned towards me. He tells me I drive him to it. He screams until the veins in his neck are bulging out and he's hitting the walls with his fists and stomping and stabbing his finger in my face while he punctuates each point about what I need to fix or change spiritually about myself. I mentioned, not during a fight, about the emotional wounds from his father, and he agreed that I have the same effect on him that his father does. (GAHH! I don't understand how or why! His father was a monster, and I don't even nag! How are we the same?? ) But if that's how he feels then oh my goodness, what are we supposed to do?
And here's the thing, I don't believe that every critique of me is wrong. I don't believe for a second that I'm perfect. I have a huge amount of flaws, I AM insecure, I do need help seeing clearly through my emotions sometimes, I DO want to see my issues and face them and work on them, and I AM grateful for someone who helps me not hide my head in the sand. I WANT to do better and be better. I've thanked him for helping me see things. But I find myself wishing more and more lately for a relationship where you're INSPIRED to be better, not bullied into it. I don't know if I should fight like crazy to get us both healed and healthy, or just go find someone else who maybe loves me in a whole different way. I daydream about that more and more lately. I just don't want it to always feel like this. Someone please offer guidance- marriage is hard, lord knows everyone on here knows how much work it takes. But is love supposed to feel like this? I cry all the time, wondering what it would be like to be with someone who thinks I'm great, and maybe gets a kick out of me, and wants to make passionate love to me sometimes.
I know a miracle could happen and things could change… maybe I'll become a spiritual super-star and earn my husband's admiration and sexual hunger, and maybe he'll learn to speak to me with love even when he's upset, instead of the verbal pummeling. But I'm increasingly sad thinking maybe I should just get out. I don't know. I admit I've cried every single day for the last six weeks and even though I love him more than I've ever loved any man, I'm losing my will to stay. it's hard to know if by leaving, I'd be making a terrible mistake, or saving myself. I'm just ready to be loved a different way.
My husband came home this week. He'd been away for a month on a job; I did nothing but soul-search while he was away. And I'm starting to take a good hard look at things.
Someone else on here commented on how people join here writing about a certain subject, and then before you know it, the layers peel away and you see what the issues TRULY are. You ain't lyin'!
I've been so frozen in a state of confusion, not trusting my own feelings, that lately all I've been clinging to is my prayer which says, PLEASE REVEAL WHATEVER NEEDS TO BE REVEALED, AND HEAL WHATEVER NEEDS TO BE HEALED.
Well. All sorts of things are coming to the surface. In retrospect I would change the title of my original post, about 'bad in bed/no chemistry' with my husband- because I think we have much bigger problems than that. That's only a symptom. I was so baffled and lost when I first came on here that all I could think to do was start with the basest, most primal ache I was having, being sad about our sex life. But shovels-full of dirt have been lifted away since he came home and I have to rethink what might actually be going on with us.
So, I have never enjoyed sex with my husband; from the wedding night on, something was just OFF. But I loved and admired and respected him so I ignored it and/or hoped for the best. But it's only become increasingly awkward over the years, for me anyway (his level of interest, which on the Enthusiasm Scale I'd rank about 1-2) has stayed the same. And i've swung back and forth between wishing like crazy he was into me more as a person, so that he'd be into me more sexually, and not even caring any more, because the sex is so agonizingly unfulfilling.
The fight last month before he left was the one that finally started to break my heart. It's the one I wrote about before, when I first joined on here- the one where I was just in total despair over feeling no sexual connection with him, that he never initiates anything with me and when it does happen, every month or two, he is really unenthusiastic about it and it lasts two minutes. I just don't feel close to him at all sexually, and completely unfulfilled physically, and beyond lonely emotionally. I was getting to that crossroads again, where I'm struggling to see our future, and I worked up all my nerve and went to him. I told him I missed him, that I needed him, that I ached for him, and we need to talk about it, that I feel like I'm dying inside.
For the first three minutes he was ok, calmly responding that the truth of the matter was that for him, although he finds me physically attractive and even sexy, he is "not spiritually attracted to me" and that if I was closer to God, we'd have the bond I was looking for.
I was crushed, of course, but in a weird way at least glad he was giving me a reason. (A reason I thought was completely preposterous since I'm a devoted Christian too, but at least it gave us something we could talk about.) I did start to cry, because hearing this is upsetting and confusing- and asked him to tell me what he meant, and to pinpoint what I could be doing differently. It went downhill fast from there. The shouting got louder and louder, and my crying got louder and louder, and everything I said to try to explain or defend myself just enraged him. Some of what he screamed at me:
(when i said i missed him and needed him: ) "WELL YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO NEED ME, YOU'RE ONLY SUPPOSED TO NEED GOD!!"
(when I said, i'm so lonely i dont know what to do: ) "ANYTHING YOU LACK IN THIS MARRIAGE IS BECAUSE OF YOU!!"
(when I said, you're my husband, you're the only one I can come to about this: ) "WHEN ARE YOU JUST GOING TO OWN IT, THAT YOU HAVE ISSUES WHEN IT COMES TO MEN, AND THIS IS YOUR PROBLEM, NOT MINE!"
(when I sobbed that I don't know what he means, and I don't know what to do: ) "YOU NEED TO GET YOURSELF RIGHT WITH GOD IF WE'RE GOING TO HAVE A FUTURE. I'VE DONE THE WORK, I'VE DONE IT ALONE (seeking God, he means- ) AND NOW IT'S YOUR TURN. THIS IS ON YOU. YOU DECIDE"
and repeatedly, at different points: "DON'T YOU PUT YOUR ISSUES ON ME. THIS IS BETWEEN YOU AND GOD".
(when I beg him to stop yelling, and I even tell him I'll receive his words better if he's not yelling: ) "YOU ARE THE ONLY ONE WHO PUSHES ME TO THIS POINT! THIS IS BECAUSE OF YOU! YOU ARE SO PRIDEFUL AND WILLFUL AND SELF-CENTERED THAT THIS IS THE ONLY WAY I CAN GET THROUGH TO YOU!!"
My reactions through all this run the gamut; I cry of course, sometimes quietly, sometimes a full-on wail, which seems to fan the flame but I can't help it; I always try to calm him down, saying Please can we just talk like normal people, please don't yell: i beg him every time, and tell him I cant take it when he yells at me like that; other moments I get angry back and try to defend myself, I yell too just so he can hear what I'm saying...
But by far the worst part(!) and he has always done this, and I absolutely cannot take it any more- I start a sentence and I get about three words in and he SCREAMS OVER TOP OF ME finishing the sentence for me with what he THINKS I was going to say- and he's not even close half the time!- and I shout PLEASE LET ME TALK! YOU HAVE TO LET ME TALK! and he just goes ballistic, screaming, "I ALREADY KNOW WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO SAY AND IT'S BULL****/A LIE/I DON'T EVEN NEED TO HEAR IT!" (Take your pick, he alternates between the three - every argument, for years.) He will not stop doing this no matter how many times I beg him and say, 'I deserve to be heard too, please let me have a voice'. makes no difference.
I am clearly an idiot, or just very determined to save us- I tried again a few nights ago to talk about this again, again very gently and non-confrontational, but you can imagine right where it went, Except this time I came right out and told him the stakes were very high- that i dont know if i can do this any more- and all that did was make him more immovable than ever that everything is on me, and that if he has to lose me he will, if that's what it takes to save me. whaaaaaat
No sleep that night. my eyes were so swollen from crying I looked like I'd gone two rounds with Mike Tyson and yet the tears kept coming. THIS ISNT RIGHT, THIS ISN'T NORMAL, I kept telling myself. So the sad desperate online search began, I was so desperate for answers or advice. It yielded some revelations, by the time it was all over, like this-
"most women don't take to a (verbal) abuser, sexually, once he shows his controlling side. Most who are abused are too traumatized to regain the level of trust necessary for physical intimacy."
OMG. Is this what's been happening???
I'm thinking back to everything he has said to me over the years. Sometimes in exact words, a lot of the time through repeated themes…That I'm not spiritual enough, that I'm 'not capable of making good decisions', that he 'knows me better than I know myself', and her;s what I am/what I'm not...that I need to believe everything he says because he's here to protect me, and that he only speaks the truth. I've been told during many arguments, in response to standing my ground, times that I am immature, insecure, and unstable.
I'm so confused. How does this line up with the other half of him? He's not one of those cruel control-freak monsters who screams if dinner is burned or if his socks aren't arranged like he likes them. He takes things in stride half the time, someone can cut him off in traffic and he barely bats an eye. He thanks me for taking good care of him, He tells me how much he loves me and is thankful for me and would be lost without me. But there's something about him having to maintain control of he and I that seems to be a major trigger for him. We get along ok if everything in our relationship is going his way, I'm noticing. He's really sweet and gentle and writes me beautiful love letters and buys me everything I could want, and is genuinely tender with me. Takes me for surprise romantic picnics. Remembers what all my favorite things are and brings them home to me whenever he can. THIS IS THE REAL HIM. He can totally melt my heart and not by being a snake charmer; Those other jerks are actually rotten to the core and the sweet side is the fake side- but my husband is a genuinely loving man, the part of him that isn't damaged. But… well… even in our day to day stuff, I have to admit… he makes me feel bad ALL the time, and I've questioned for years if that's what it's supposed to feel like. He snaps at me over stuff and tells me if I'm hurt, it's because I'm too sensitive. I've trusted him so much and for so long it never occurred to me that he could be wrong when he makes everything my fault, and that I end up apologizing constantly, over things he's just hurt my feelings over. Something sticky spills in the fridge that i didnt even know about, it's immediately, "What did you do??!" and he's so aggravated. At my office Christmas party last year, when I was so excited to have everyone meet him for the first time, he was so pissed because I was mistaken, I told him it was a dressy night (and half the staff showed up casual, we were dressy) that he acted like a complete ass the entire night, being stand-offish to all my friends, and to my doctor boss, and I was so mortified, and kept trying to be extra-cheery and laugh it off in front of everyone, but he insisted we leave early, and yelled at me the whole way home. And I ended up crying and apologizing like crazy .
I understand where it comes from, i really do, and it's awful. he was severely beaten by his father as a little boy and even worse, verbally tormented to a degree few of us can understand. He says he's made peace over it and forgiven his father, and he talks bout it with no bitterness so I've believed him, I've chosen to believe him.
But knowing this doesn't make it any easier when it's turned towards me. He tells me I drive him to it. He screams until the veins in his neck are bulging out and he's hitting the walls with his fists and stomping and stabbing his finger in my face while he punctuates each point about what I need to fix or change spiritually about myself. I mentioned, not during a fight, about the emotional wounds from his father, and he agreed that I have the same effect on him that his father does. (GAHH! I don't understand how or why! His father was a monster, and I don't even nag! How are we the same?? ) But if that's how he feels then oh my goodness, what are we supposed to do?
And here's the thing, I don't believe that every critique of me is wrong. I don't believe for a second that I'm perfect. I have a huge amount of flaws, I AM insecure, I do need help seeing clearly through my emotions sometimes, I DO want to see my issues and face them and work on them, and I AM grateful for someone who helps me not hide my head in the sand. I WANT to do better and be better. I've thanked him for helping me see things. But I find myself wishing more and more lately for a relationship where you're INSPIRED to be better, not bullied into it. I don't know if I should fight like crazy to get us both healed and healthy, or just go find someone else who maybe loves me in a whole different way. I daydream about that more and more lately. I just don't want it to always feel like this. Someone please offer guidance- marriage is hard, lord knows everyone on here knows how much work it takes. But is love supposed to feel like this? I cry all the time, wondering what it would be like to be with someone who thinks I'm great, and maybe gets a kick out of me, and wants to make passionate love to me sometimes.
I know a miracle could happen and things could change… maybe I'll become a spiritual super-star and earn my husband's admiration and sexual hunger, and maybe he'll learn to speak to me with love even when he's upset, instead of the verbal pummeling. But I'm increasingly sad thinking maybe I should just get out. I don't know. I admit I've cried every single day for the last six weeks and even though I love him more than I've ever loved any man, I'm losing my will to stay. it's hard to know if by leaving, I'd be making a terrible mistake, or saving myself. I'm just ready to be loved a different way.
Put the internet to work for you.
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