I pride myself on avoiding absolutes, but sharing the details of my situation I think would lead most to tell me 100% done is where I need to be.
I've had 10 months to mull over this, so emotions are not a motivator. Revenge and justice are avoided. I'm clear in my thinking and trying to do what is best for my children and ultimately my wife.
I feel I do need to share a brief summary of where I am at:
- 10 months ago I found an excessive amount of phones calls and texting on our phone records happening between my wife and a mutual friend of ours.
- Upon confronting her she downplayed it, but eventually admitted getting emotional support from him.
- I demanded she stop talking to him immediately, he needs to be removed from the equation. She reluctantly agreed.
(My intuition suspected a lot for the last 10 months and I was right almost every time)
- a week after the confrontation, I suspected she was with him after her night class. I called and caught her with him. Abandoned industrial building. Both said it was cause they wanted to say goodbye in person (riiiight).
- She got defensive and it took her 7 weeks to block him from facebook. MC (Marriage counselor) convinced her finally it was what she needed to do.
- A few weeks later I suspected she met him again, but she threw me off. Lied to my face (I misread her lie to my face, didn't know it was that easy). Now I know she did meet him again that night.
- She was committed to keeping our marriage in tact and was giving me just enough to not give up. I was in crisis mode doing everything I could to fix, and believe.
- Spring was difficult... a few more lies and I caught her venting to another friend I was suspicious of instead of coming to me. MC and both of us were working on building walls around our marriage. She painted the picture of doing this but was still seeking support outside and wanting attention from men to sympathize with her. Creating a fantasy that she was a victim in this. Lying to them, just as much as she lied to me.
- I slowly gave up on love ever reentering the equation and resigned to the fact that maybe she is really committed and we can move on for the sake of our kids (two young girls under age of 5)
- I became apathetic, to protect myself, but at the same time continued to work like hell to be supportive for her. To communicate better. I always felt it was fake on her side. I really was genuine... looking for something to hold onto... hope. My parents describe me as an eternal optimist. I always want to believe people are good and things will be better.
- A few weeks ago I noticed some things that concerned me. suspicions. I caused me to dig.
What I found is horrifying: (the last two days she turned 100% transparent - so she says... and she's openly talking about everything in a last ditch effort to get me to stay)
- When we were dating in college she was promiscuous, sleeping around with other guys. I had no idea. This continued even into our engagement.
- One one week period when we were on a break she freaked out about me spending time with a girl and got enraged. For the last 10 years she brings that up to guilt me. I can't believe looking back now that during the same period she was having sex with multiple guys... and she's pointing to my innocent exchange with a girl as I was looking for answers while my girlfriend asked for a break.
- 2 years after we got married my wife pursued a man while on vacation at the beach (5 hours away from our house). She had sex with him a few days after meeting him. She says she liked the attention and felt she didn't have a choice but to give him sex to keep him interested. This happened while her and I were actively trying to conceive our first daughter. I'm horrified at the idea that my daughter could have ended up being someone elses. How reckless. She admits to it being unprotected sex. (I've been tested recently... no STDs thank God!). I know my daughter is mine. She looks exactly like me. I suppose I need to get my daughter tested also? She claims she knows for sure because she never had sex with the guy in the 3 month period around when she was conceived.
- 2 years later she had sex with this guy again. She says she went to visit him in an effort to prove she could stand up to him and not give in sexually. That she just wanted emotional support... but that it still lead to sex. She says after it she cried and he asked why. She said she couldn't help how she was and wanted to know why she seeks this attention. Why she never came to me with these problems baffles me. She faked to me being happy in our marriage. While telling these other men I was not giving her the attention she needed.
- Last fall she pursued this most recent guy (the one I thought was just an emotional affair). She admits now they met way more than she told me before. She also says that she desperately wanted it to turn physical with him also, but he pushed her away. She was trying to convince him she wanted to leave me to be with him and he wasn't buying it until she actually did. So he wouldn't allow her to kiss him, but they texted all the time and exchanged I love yous.
- I found out that in the 24 hours I gave her to say goodbye to him.. she created a fake account and continued to communicate with him for 5 months through our councelling and MC stuff. MC was telling me I needed to trust her, she had us both fooled. The whole time she was still telling this man she was planning to leave me. She desired to be with him. Eventually her therapist (who only found out about this man because I called and told her I hope they are talking about him; to which I got an ear full from my wife for violating her trust in trying to contact her therapist) convinced her she wasn't making a choice between him and me... it was a choice to either be married to me or not married to me.
- I think the stability I bring to her life scared her in losing that and she tried to come back to me, but she is so broken.
- For the last 10 months she'd lied to both our MC and even her personal therapist of 10+ years (she suffers depression)... neither one of them, or I, knew anything about the two men who's admitting to a physical affair with now. They also both didn't know about the emotional affair guy until I brought him up. She does a good job of playing the victim in all of this... seeking support from everyone from a "feel sorry for me" sort of way.
- I desired for her to seek help for herself. I want her to be a healthier person. It is clear to me now that it is too little too late to be open and transparent. In her transparency I see so much effortless lying that there is no way I can ever feel comfortable enough in this marriage to believe she has changed.
Someone put it a good way. I read this to my wife and she agreed:
"She has low self esteem. That explains her need for attention and the sexual abuse as a child makes that attention sexualised. On some level she thinks you are more than she deserves and appears to be subconsciously sabotaging the relationship. "
I've heard my wife say too many times that she wants to work on us... but she is a selfish person, admittedly. She has baggage and I never want to blame her for who she is. I cannot live with the lies. I don't mind helping someone get better, but she won't even do the things to help herself (how can she not talk about this stuff to her own therapist of 10+ years! Instead she lies to the therapist about me, making up stories about how she feels I don't give her attention... while coming home and telling me "You can't fulfill me, stop trying to be so involved in my life.") I cannot live with the idea that my wife has shared a bed with multiple men while putting on a smile with me. I cannot live with the idea that while telling me "oh honey, we're not in love now, but if we have kids we'll be more in love" in response to my question "I'm scared to have kids with you because I feel there isn't enough love here. Do you think that is going to change?" While she was telling me this she was sexting this guy... and having sex with him.
the lies all the way through this "healing"..
Right now she is in crisis doing everything she can to hold us together. She's being transparent (she says...) I think even if she gets help... I can't ever be ok in this marriage again. Even if she really fixes herself, I'll always feel insecure with her. I'll always be looking over my back. I hung in there for the kids... I don't want my girls growing up seeing a mother who disrespects their father. I don't want them to learn that is ok.
How do I move on in the healthiest way. I don't want her to get nasty and destructive. I don't want to either... I am a very accommodating guy - I can put up with a lot. I can keep my emotions in check, even through this. She's always going to be the mother of my kids... and involved in their lives. How do I get to mediation without her lawyering up? I'm not trying to manipulate her, at all. I feel like if I leave RIGHT NOW... she's going to equate being truthful and forthcoming with facts with being hurt by her husband leaving. Do I need to pretend for the next few months I'm trying... maybe I should really try? I don't want to fall into this trap again. I'm scared. I need her to realize that my decision to leave is based on our incompatibility (indirectly the choices she's made)... not because she's suddenly being honest with me and it is horrifying.
Can she screw me if I leave now. Can the state (Virginia) say that I'm abandoning if she is saying she wants to continue to work on this, and I'm not? I have a text from the guy confirming the physical affair. I know the courts don't care about the infidelity, or emotions involved. I know that the courts favor the mother... how do I protect all of our assets (I don't mind her having half... we had nothing when we got married... now we have about half a million in assets between us. I'm not vengerful or out to screw her. I want her to get on her feet and be as healthy as she can for the sake of our kids). In a weird twisted way I feel like being separated from her she'll actually take my advice and confide in me more. Is that weird? While married, I'm someone to keep at a distance, separated we'll fall back into friends... both recognizing our kids need us to play nice? Wishful thinking? Why do I feel we're different there? Doesn't seem to be the reality in most divorces, does it? If it matters we were best friends growing up. We used to talk about everything. I knew her in HS. We never dated. We knew eachother for 8 years before we ever dated. We were closer then. Once we got married a wall went up with her. She became more and more distant. I feel like I married my best friend... and now I'm married to my worst nightmare.
She doesn't have a job... stay at home, but she has a college degree. I want to just split 50-50 and move on. Find a loving mother/wife someone who can be positive for my girls. I know she's going to get child support, and I don't mind that. I want my girls provided for. How do I avoid alimony? Do they even do that anymore? So many questions.
I suppose I need to schedule a consultation. Just looking for answers while I research who to see...
I'm so apathetic at this point it almost scares me. I laugh about it. I'm sad for my girls. I'm hopeful that a silver lining will present itself in this separation (and eventual divorce).
She still thinks we have hope. Do I need to be frank with her that I don't see that? Right now she knows I'm dealing with a lot of new information and evaluating. She is doing her best to be as pleasant as possible. For the first time in 10 years she wrote me a love letter today... and made me a lunch for work... and called me twice to tell me she loves me and the girls. Is this is emotional manipulation? Is her reality that she feels she's is really going to get better with me? I refuse to fall into the trap again.
Looking for advice to make this as positive as possible moving forward. My goal is to leave.
I've had 10 months to mull over this, so emotions are not a motivator. Revenge and justice are avoided. I'm clear in my thinking and trying to do what is best for my children and ultimately my wife.
I feel I do need to share a brief summary of where I am at:
- 10 months ago I found an excessive amount of phones calls and texting on our phone records happening between my wife and a mutual friend of ours.
- Upon confronting her she downplayed it, but eventually admitted getting emotional support from him.
- I demanded she stop talking to him immediately, he needs to be removed from the equation. She reluctantly agreed.
(My intuition suspected a lot for the last 10 months and I was right almost every time)
- a week after the confrontation, I suspected she was with him after her night class. I called and caught her with him. Abandoned industrial building. Both said it was cause they wanted to say goodbye in person (riiiight).
- She got defensive and it took her 7 weeks to block him from facebook. MC (Marriage counselor) convinced her finally it was what she needed to do.
- A few weeks later I suspected she met him again, but she threw me off. Lied to my face (I misread her lie to my face, didn't know it was that easy). Now I know she did meet him again that night.
- She was committed to keeping our marriage in tact and was giving me just enough to not give up. I was in crisis mode doing everything I could to fix, and believe.
- Spring was difficult... a few more lies and I caught her venting to another friend I was suspicious of instead of coming to me. MC and both of us were working on building walls around our marriage. She painted the picture of doing this but was still seeking support outside and wanting attention from men to sympathize with her. Creating a fantasy that she was a victim in this. Lying to them, just as much as she lied to me.
- I slowly gave up on love ever reentering the equation and resigned to the fact that maybe she is really committed and we can move on for the sake of our kids (two young girls under age of 5)
- I became apathetic, to protect myself, but at the same time continued to work like hell to be supportive for her. To communicate better. I always felt it was fake on her side. I really was genuine... looking for something to hold onto... hope. My parents describe me as an eternal optimist. I always want to believe people are good and things will be better.
- A few weeks ago I noticed some things that concerned me. suspicions. I caused me to dig.
What I found is horrifying: (the last two days she turned 100% transparent - so she says... and she's openly talking about everything in a last ditch effort to get me to stay)
- When we were dating in college she was promiscuous, sleeping around with other guys. I had no idea. This continued even into our engagement.
- One one week period when we were on a break she freaked out about me spending time with a girl and got enraged. For the last 10 years she brings that up to guilt me. I can't believe looking back now that during the same period she was having sex with multiple guys... and she's pointing to my innocent exchange with a girl as I was looking for answers while my girlfriend asked for a break.
- 2 years after we got married my wife pursued a man while on vacation at the beach (5 hours away from our house). She had sex with him a few days after meeting him. She says she liked the attention and felt she didn't have a choice but to give him sex to keep him interested. This happened while her and I were actively trying to conceive our first daughter. I'm horrified at the idea that my daughter could have ended up being someone elses. How reckless. She admits to it being unprotected sex. (I've been tested recently... no STDs thank God!). I know my daughter is mine. She looks exactly like me. I suppose I need to get my daughter tested also? She claims she knows for sure because she never had sex with the guy in the 3 month period around when she was conceived.
- 2 years later she had sex with this guy again. She says she went to visit him in an effort to prove she could stand up to him and not give in sexually. That she just wanted emotional support... but that it still lead to sex. She says after it she cried and he asked why. She said she couldn't help how she was and wanted to know why she seeks this attention. Why she never came to me with these problems baffles me. She faked to me being happy in our marriage. While telling these other men I was not giving her the attention she needed.
- Last fall she pursued this most recent guy (the one I thought was just an emotional affair). She admits now they met way more than she told me before. She also says that she desperately wanted it to turn physical with him also, but he pushed her away. She was trying to convince him she wanted to leave me to be with him and he wasn't buying it until she actually did. So he wouldn't allow her to kiss him, but they texted all the time and exchanged I love yous.
- I found out that in the 24 hours I gave her to say goodbye to him.. she created a fake account and continued to communicate with him for 5 months through our councelling and MC stuff. MC was telling me I needed to trust her, she had us both fooled. The whole time she was still telling this man she was planning to leave me. She desired to be with him. Eventually her therapist (who only found out about this man because I called and told her I hope they are talking about him; to which I got an ear full from my wife for violating her trust in trying to contact her therapist) convinced her she wasn't making a choice between him and me... it was a choice to either be married to me or not married to me.
- I think the stability I bring to her life scared her in losing that and she tried to come back to me, but she is so broken.
- For the last 10 months she'd lied to both our MC and even her personal therapist of 10+ years (she suffers depression)... neither one of them, or I, knew anything about the two men who's admitting to a physical affair with now. They also both didn't know about the emotional affair guy until I brought him up. She does a good job of playing the victim in all of this... seeking support from everyone from a "feel sorry for me" sort of way.
- I desired for her to seek help for herself. I want her to be a healthier person. It is clear to me now that it is too little too late to be open and transparent. In her transparency I see so much effortless lying that there is no way I can ever feel comfortable enough in this marriage to believe she has changed.
Someone put it a good way. I read this to my wife and she agreed:
"She has low self esteem. That explains her need for attention and the sexual abuse as a child makes that attention sexualised. On some level she thinks you are more than she deserves and appears to be subconsciously sabotaging the relationship. "
I've heard my wife say too many times that she wants to work on us... but she is a selfish person, admittedly. She has baggage and I never want to blame her for who she is. I cannot live with the lies. I don't mind helping someone get better, but she won't even do the things to help herself (how can she not talk about this stuff to her own therapist of 10+ years! Instead she lies to the therapist about me, making up stories about how she feels I don't give her attention... while coming home and telling me "You can't fulfill me, stop trying to be so involved in my life.") I cannot live with the idea that my wife has shared a bed with multiple men while putting on a smile with me. I cannot live with the idea that while telling me "oh honey, we're not in love now, but if we have kids we'll be more in love" in response to my question "I'm scared to have kids with you because I feel there isn't enough love here. Do you think that is going to change?" While she was telling me this she was sexting this guy... and having sex with him.
the lies all the way through this "healing"..
Right now she is in crisis doing everything she can to hold us together. She's being transparent (she says...) I think even if she gets help... I can't ever be ok in this marriage again. Even if she really fixes herself, I'll always feel insecure with her. I'll always be looking over my back. I hung in there for the kids... I don't want my girls growing up seeing a mother who disrespects their father. I don't want them to learn that is ok.
How do I move on in the healthiest way. I don't want her to get nasty and destructive. I don't want to either... I am a very accommodating guy - I can put up with a lot. I can keep my emotions in check, even through this. She's always going to be the mother of my kids... and involved in their lives. How do I get to mediation without her lawyering up? I'm not trying to manipulate her, at all. I feel like if I leave RIGHT NOW... she's going to equate being truthful and forthcoming with facts with being hurt by her husband leaving. Do I need to pretend for the next few months I'm trying... maybe I should really try? I don't want to fall into this trap again. I'm scared. I need her to realize that my decision to leave is based on our incompatibility (indirectly the choices she's made)... not because she's suddenly being honest with me and it is horrifying.
Can she screw me if I leave now. Can the state (Virginia) say that I'm abandoning if she is saying she wants to continue to work on this, and I'm not? I have a text from the guy confirming the physical affair. I know the courts don't care about the infidelity, or emotions involved. I know that the courts favor the mother... how do I protect all of our assets (I don't mind her having half... we had nothing when we got married... now we have about half a million in assets between us. I'm not vengerful or out to screw her. I want her to get on her feet and be as healthy as she can for the sake of our kids). In a weird twisted way I feel like being separated from her she'll actually take my advice and confide in me more. Is that weird? While married, I'm someone to keep at a distance, separated we'll fall back into friends... both recognizing our kids need us to play nice? Wishful thinking? Why do I feel we're different there? Doesn't seem to be the reality in most divorces, does it? If it matters we were best friends growing up. We used to talk about everything. I knew her in HS. We never dated. We knew eachother for 8 years before we ever dated. We were closer then. Once we got married a wall went up with her. She became more and more distant. I feel like I married my best friend... and now I'm married to my worst nightmare.
She doesn't have a job... stay at home, but she has a college degree. I want to just split 50-50 and move on. Find a loving mother/wife someone who can be positive for my girls. I know she's going to get child support, and I don't mind that. I want my girls provided for. How do I avoid alimony? Do they even do that anymore? So many questions.
I suppose I need to schedule a consultation. Just looking for answers while I research who to see...
I'm so apathetic at this point it almost scares me. I laugh about it. I'm sad for my girls. I'm hopeful that a silver lining will present itself in this separation (and eventual divorce).
She still thinks we have hope. Do I need to be frank with her that I don't see that? Right now she knows I'm dealing with a lot of new information and evaluating. She is doing her best to be as pleasant as possible. For the first time in 10 years she wrote me a love letter today... and made me a lunch for work... and called me twice to tell me she loves me and the girls. Is this is emotional manipulation? Is her reality that she feels she's is really going to get better with me? I refuse to fall into the trap again.
Looking for advice to make this as positive as possible moving forward. My goal is to leave.
Put the internet to work for you.
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