Hi All,
Obviously I’m new to the site and only 3 weeks out from my DS PA D-Day. I will create a separate post requesting some other advice I need pertaining to on my specific crazy situation.
This post is a more generic help request that may benefit others as well.
So, I cannot stand the Trickle Truths I’m getting/uncovering. So I thought that I would give her the following request, in her own handwriting, to write what happened. Please give me advice on what I’m missing, good ideas, bad ideas, and where I’m going over the line. Also, tone, word choice, grammar and spell-check are always appreciated… I’m mentally spent.
My goals being:
1) stop the lies (omission included).
2) box her in on the truth, making harder to twist/lie about what happened. Also, detect inconsistencies.
3) have a written record to avoid the typical DS “I didn’t say/mean that” backtracking
4) have a written record to refute the secret lies that she has been spreading about me/us to friends and family. Also helpful if issues/stories arise years from now (I know those “fuzzy” recollections will).
5) Be a starting point for her to look me in the eyes and SAY IT ALL. A conversation outline if you will.
6) Have a record/story for the marriage counselor when we start MC. I’m not going to waste my time in sessions 1)prying out truths or 2)for her downplay/massage what occurred. Get all the EAs/PAs on the table from day 1 of MC (idealistic, I know).
7) Know all the names of the guys involved for future use/watchlist
8) Uncover the toxic/enabling friends & family
Ok here’s my written request to the DS:
“Dear <DS>,
You need to be completely open and honest with me about what has occurred over the course of our relationship (dating through current day). I will not seek reconcilement if I continue to be lied to – either directly, with the twisting of facts, or by omitting information.
I know you continue to lie to me - this is completely destructive to any chance of reconciliation. Continuing to lie to me demonstrates: 1) you are not taking responsibility for your actions 2) you lack integrity and are untrustworthy 3) you continue to attempt to manipulate me 4) you have no respect for me or our relationship 5) you will not change.
I know you want to avoid discussing, confessing, and drudging up things that you think I may or may not know. Well, it’s time for you take accountability for ALL of your actions and also give me piece of mind. Only then do we have a chance of a real reconciliation. Otherwise, I will leave you and never look back.
This is it <DS>, this is your chance to tell the full truth and correct all the previous lies. Let me stress, THIS IS IT, THIS IS THE MOMENT. Be wise; lay it all out on the table. If your mind says “I don’t know if he knows this thing, should I write it down?” DO IT! Every time that thought crosses your mind, remember this and DO IT – DO NOT OMMIT, TWIST, OR MANIPULATE information!
I want you to handwrite, in ink please, a full account of your misbehaviors over the course of our entire relationship. I want the following:
All the men (and if any women). For each person:
1) full name
2) age
3) job
4) where they live
5) their phone numbers, email addresses, fb names, etc.
6) were they in a relationship, if so, type of relationship
7) do they have children
8) how you met
9) key dates
10) all manners/extent of communication (FB, texting, phone, in-person)
11) how many conversations
12) what was discussed/shared – both emotional and s6xual. Did you say you loved the person, did they you? Also, how specifically did you put me and/or us down.
13) whether you met in person
14) were there explicit photos/videos sent by either person
15) physically – I do not want specific play by play details, just list all the following that apply with frequency, key dates, and where it occurred: meeting up, hugging, handholding, kissing, cuddling, foreplay, removing clothes/nudity, masturbation, oral, intercourse, anal, etc. Of course, whether condoms were used or not.
16) Why and how did it end
17) Have either of you tried to be in communication since <Enter D-DAY>
List all friends & family who know anything about these events - either before, during or after:
1) When did they find out
2) How did they find out
3) What was their reaction (besides surprised)
4) Did their significant other know, when?
5) Did they encourage, discourage, or remain neutral (be specific)
6) Did they help you with it in anyway (e.g. introductions, giving you dating advise, relaying communications, giving you advise on how to conceal this, providing cover, directly lying to me, etc.).
7) Did they directly meet or speak (talk or text) to the guy
8) How have you badmouth me and/or our relationship to them.
9) How have you misled, exaggerated, omitted, or let falsities hang in the air with them about me and/or us. Our general relationship as well as the events in question. Be very specific.
10) Have they cheated in anyway themselves, when, with who, does their significant other know?
11) Do they sincerely want us to be together, are indifferent, or want us to be apart (what they tell you, plus your gut instincts).
12) What is their current opinion of me
Anything you also think I would like to know, or be upset not knowing, write it down.
As you can tell, I want a thorough & full disclosure. Write, write, write. If you finish writing, and realize you need to go back to add something else, just have a footnoted addendum/extra pages.
I’m only willing to go to counseling and attempt reconciliation IF you give me the full truth. Healing starts with truth, so woman-up or I’m gone forever.
Love,
Your Husband
----------------------------------------------------------------------
35yr Male, Never EA'd or PA'd. No Kids. 2nd marriage 2nd time dealing with disloyal wife. EAs & PAs both times.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
1st Marriage: 2002 to 2004. Unfaithful Wife Left. I attempted a full court R, but she left w/ OM.
2nd Marriage: 2010 – present (2yrs). Mentally ill DW. Marriage has been a nightmare for me due to her severe clinical mental illnesses. She wants an R, I’m struggling with that prospect..
2nd Marriage PA D-day Oct 19th 2012. Attempted PAs with 10-15 other men.
Obviously I’m new to the site and only 3 weeks out from my DS PA D-Day. I will create a separate post requesting some other advice I need pertaining to on my specific crazy situation.
This post is a more generic help request that may benefit others as well.
So, I cannot stand the Trickle Truths I’m getting/uncovering. So I thought that I would give her the following request, in her own handwriting, to write what happened. Please give me advice on what I’m missing, good ideas, bad ideas, and where I’m going over the line. Also, tone, word choice, grammar and spell-check are always appreciated… I’m mentally spent.
My goals being:
1) stop the lies (omission included).
2) box her in on the truth, making harder to twist/lie about what happened. Also, detect inconsistencies.
3) have a written record to avoid the typical DS “I didn’t say/mean that” backtracking
4) have a written record to refute the secret lies that she has been spreading about me/us to friends and family. Also helpful if issues/stories arise years from now (I know those “fuzzy” recollections will).
5) Be a starting point for her to look me in the eyes and SAY IT ALL. A conversation outline if you will.
6) Have a record/story for the marriage counselor when we start MC. I’m not going to waste my time in sessions 1)prying out truths or 2)for her downplay/massage what occurred. Get all the EAs/PAs on the table from day 1 of MC (idealistic, I know).
7) Know all the names of the guys involved for future use/watchlist
8) Uncover the toxic/enabling friends & family
Ok here’s my written request to the DS:
“Dear <DS>,
You need to be completely open and honest with me about what has occurred over the course of our relationship (dating through current day). I will not seek reconcilement if I continue to be lied to – either directly, with the twisting of facts, or by omitting information.
I know you continue to lie to me - this is completely destructive to any chance of reconciliation. Continuing to lie to me demonstrates: 1) you are not taking responsibility for your actions 2) you lack integrity and are untrustworthy 3) you continue to attempt to manipulate me 4) you have no respect for me or our relationship 5) you will not change.
I know you want to avoid discussing, confessing, and drudging up things that you think I may or may not know. Well, it’s time for you take accountability for ALL of your actions and also give me piece of mind. Only then do we have a chance of a real reconciliation. Otherwise, I will leave you and never look back.
This is it <DS>, this is your chance to tell the full truth and correct all the previous lies. Let me stress, THIS IS IT, THIS IS THE MOMENT. Be wise; lay it all out on the table. If your mind says “I don’t know if he knows this thing, should I write it down?” DO IT! Every time that thought crosses your mind, remember this and DO IT – DO NOT OMMIT, TWIST, OR MANIPULATE information!
I want you to handwrite, in ink please, a full account of your misbehaviors over the course of our entire relationship. I want the following:
All the men (and if any women). For each person:
1) full name
2) age
3) job
4) where they live
5) their phone numbers, email addresses, fb names, etc.
6) were they in a relationship, if so, type of relationship
7) do they have children
8) how you met
9) key dates
10) all manners/extent of communication (FB, texting, phone, in-person)
11) how many conversations
12) what was discussed/shared – both emotional and s6xual. Did you say you loved the person, did they you? Also, how specifically did you put me and/or us down.
13) whether you met in person
14) were there explicit photos/videos sent by either person
15) physically – I do not want specific play by play details, just list all the following that apply with frequency, key dates, and where it occurred: meeting up, hugging, handholding, kissing, cuddling, foreplay, removing clothes/nudity, masturbation, oral, intercourse, anal, etc. Of course, whether condoms were used or not.
16) Why and how did it end
17) Have either of you tried to be in communication since <Enter D-DAY>
List all friends & family who know anything about these events - either before, during or after:
1) When did they find out
2) How did they find out
3) What was their reaction (besides surprised)
4) Did their significant other know, when?
5) Did they encourage, discourage, or remain neutral (be specific)
6) Did they help you with it in anyway (e.g. introductions, giving you dating advise, relaying communications, giving you advise on how to conceal this, providing cover, directly lying to me, etc.).
7) Did they directly meet or speak (talk or text) to the guy
8) How have you badmouth me and/or our relationship to them.
9) How have you misled, exaggerated, omitted, or let falsities hang in the air with them about me and/or us. Our general relationship as well as the events in question. Be very specific.
10) Have they cheated in anyway themselves, when, with who, does their significant other know?
11) Do they sincerely want us to be together, are indifferent, or want us to be apart (what they tell you, plus your gut instincts).
12) What is their current opinion of me
Anything you also think I would like to know, or be upset not knowing, write it down.
As you can tell, I want a thorough & full disclosure. Write, write, write. If you finish writing, and realize you need to go back to add something else, just have a footnoted addendum/extra pages.
I’m only willing to go to counseling and attempt reconciliation IF you give me the full truth. Healing starts with truth, so woman-up or I’m gone forever.
Love,
Your Husband
----------------------------------------------------------------------
35yr Male, Never EA'd or PA'd. No Kids. 2nd marriage 2nd time dealing with disloyal wife. EAs & PAs both times.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
1st Marriage: 2002 to 2004. Unfaithful Wife Left. I attempted a full court R, but she left w/ OM.
2nd Marriage: 2010 – present (2yrs). Mentally ill DW. Marriage has been a nightmare for me due to her severe clinical mental illnesses. She wants an R, I’m struggling with that prospect..
2nd Marriage PA D-day Oct 19th 2012. Attempted PAs with 10-15 other men.
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